Conde: I want to play for the Red Bulls

                                                                              Photo by ISI Photos

When Wilman Conde made the move from Colombian club Millonarios to Major League Soccer's Chicago Fire last year, he did so in order to continue playing for Juan Carlos Osorio, a coach he respected greatly and felt could him improve as a player. It appears Conde wants to be reunited with Osorio yet again.

Conde told Kathryn Knapp of Chicagoland Soccer News that he wants to be traded to the Red Bulls. In an emailed statement to Chicagoland Soccer News, Conde wrote the following:

"As you may recall, it was through Juan Carlos Osorio that I came to MLS, and  the Chicago Fire particularly," Conde said. "That is why I want you to know that I wish to continue to work with him and rejoin him with his new team, the New York Red Bulls.

"The Chicago Fire is a great institution but my interest and desires are no longer with this team. It is a difficult situation but it is my desire to pursue my career with the New York Red Bulls starting this season."

Conde went into more detail with the Chicago Tribune's Luis Arroyave, who spoke with Conde on Saturday.

Conde's trade request comes as no surprise to those close to him, who have been aware of his desire to be reunited with Osorio since Osorio left the Chicago Fire to become the Red Bulls head coach in December.

Whether Chicago will let such a reunion take place is another story. Conde was arguably Chicago's best defender last season and the Red Bulls would have to pay a significant amount to pry Conde away from the Fire. That is assuming the Fire will even listen to offers. The acrimony surrounding Osorio's departure from Chicago could lead to the Fire to refusing to even consider dealing Conde to the Red Bulls.

Chicago general manager John Guppy issued this statement through a team spokesperson:

"We are aware of Wilman's interest to play in New York," Guppy said. "However, Wilman is under contract with the Chicago Fire and we do expect him to perform all of his obligations in a professional manner. As always, the interests of the Chicago Fire are paramount in all player decisions."

Conde's willingness to go public at this time could suggest that he is ready to take a hard stance on his desire to be traded to the Red Bulls. Could he leave Chicago's training camp and hold out? It is entirely possible.

What could the Red Bulls offer Chicago? Midfielder Dema Kovalenko and Seth Stammler and defenders Kevin Goldthwaite, Jeff Parke and Carlos Mendes could all be part of a trade, as could goalkeeper Zach Thornton. I know Fire fans won't accept anything less than Juan Pablo Angel or Jozy Altidore, but neither of those two players are going anywhere. I also doubt that Dane Richards goes anywhere.

If the Fire is willing to listen then Osorio is likely to make a strong offer because Conde is the exact type of player he has been searching for this off-season, a left-footed defender who could play left back in a 3-5-2 or left back and center back in a 4-4-2. Conde's versatility and young age (he's 25) make him a valuable commodity.

What do you think about Conde's proclamation? Are you surprised? Do you think he's out of line? Do you think Chicago should let him go? Do you think the Red Bulls should trade Dane Richards and draft picks? What about a package of Kovalenko, Magee Parke or Mendes, Thornton and next year's No. 1?

Share your thoughts below.

Comments

[Steve]

As a Fire fan I'd rather let Conde rot than trade him to NY.

Especially, for that load of crap you suggested (no offense) could be coming our way in return.

One of the most impactful arrivals to the league last year for has beens and never weres? Half of whom we've already gotten rid of. Please no.

[Onionsack]

Give them Dema and Thornton back the Fire originals.

[Erik Abarca]

Defenitly not Dane Richards, but Kovalenko, Magee, Thornton and next year's No. 1, is ok.

[Jeffrey]

Sounds like Osorio is guilty of collusion!

[Joe]

I think Altidore has to be in the deal to get him. Conde and Barrett for Altidore, Dema and next years number 1. Conde is making 145 grand a year, so that would give us even more cap room to get some1 big hopefully. We could always put Bakary in the center with CJ. I think Jozy has to be in the deal for it to be "ok."

[furia yanqui]

Who the hell do these guys think they are?

Can any player send out an email and say, "I like this coach and I plan to continue my career with him"?

Has any player been so presumptuous to do that?

[Eric]

This is complete garbage. First New York gets Osorio because the guy's wife doesn't like Chicago and now this whole issue with Conde. Personally, I'd rather see Conde go if he doesn't want to play for us but I'll be absolutely furious if New York tries to screw us by offering just Dema or some crap. I want Richards, Brunner, Altidore, someone who can actually provide some help.

I hope we destroy New York this year.

[ScoofyFireFan]

I think the poster on Luis Arroyave's blog said it best:

"Are these professionals or 13 year old girls?"

I don't think RBNY even has anyone who is worth Conde unless you include Altidore (and even then, not by himself, bc theres no way he'll still be here after the summer window). No, an unhappy Conde is better than letting NY have him. Maybe we should trade him somewhere else, so they can deal with him unhappy. How about Jonathan Bornstein or Eddie Robinson?

[EDB]

let him rot

[adam]

ives,

as a few posters above mentioned, any combination of dema/mendes/goldthwaite/parke/thornton/etc would still not meet what conde would bring to NY. sure thats a great deal...for NY. the only way it makes sense for chicago is in salary cap numbers. NY will have to trade someone that is of true individual value, not a sum of parts that may or may not equal up to conde. as mentioned, players like richards or freeman would be more acceptable (as we know jozy is out of the question if NY is turning down millions that can operate the team for years so conde doesnt quite stack up)

[ScoofyFireFan]

Besides, for it to be a fair trade, we need someone with way better hair.

[Joamiq]

Joe - Altidore? HAHAHAHAHAHA
Good one!

If Conde wants to leave, the Fire doesn't really have much leverage. Enjoy Stammler and Goldthwaite. And my condolences; it's not really fair to Fire fans. But that's the way it is.

[kebzach]

The "Kovalenko, Magee, Thornton and next year's No. 1" offer can be translated as:

A guy making too much money, 2 pieces of filler junk, and a draft pick.

No thanks.

Kovalenko can stay in the deal, but only if NY agrees to pick up salary or if Dema agrees to play for less.

The #1 pick can stay as well of course.

But even with those 2 things, the deal is at least 2 pieces short. Need to include at least another NY starter and at least a reserve as well.

[furnture music]

I am with you Joamiq...and I will add my own hahaha's... No way Jozy goes to the Chicas (pun intended) for Conde... VanDenB, Dema and Magee or Thornton for Conde would be an excellent offer! :)

[JT]

"If Conde wants to leave, the Fire doesn't really have much leverage"

Except a signed contract. This isn't MLS of 1999 where if a quality player held out or disliked his coach the league would intervene and send him to a new team (Logan sending Valderrama back to Tampa Bay after his benching in Miami).

Chicago is under no obligation to trade him. I'd rather him hold out and not play soccer for a year than send him to a conference rival.

[kebzach]

The Fire has more leverage than you'd think...if it chooses to use it.

The Fire still has salary cap space, which means that they could tell Conde to sit at home and shut up while they bring someone else in before the 4-15-08 transfer window closes. It's not the greatest use of salary cap room, but it is an option.

There's no way that the Fire should be trading Conde at less than $ 1.20 on the dollar. Not to a ladder climbing leach like Juan Carlos Osario.

[tex]

What is this guy thinking? Does he think he's in Europe or playing for a real league...no, no ,no buddy boy this is MLS and we don't operate like a professional league here my friend. You must think you can "put in your transfer" like the rest, of the world not here in MLS. We have rules that are all in the league favor a crap on players so you will play where we decide. Next thing will be free agency...we aren't having that either...we are bush league and like it.

[Jeffrey]

Stammler and Goldthwaite are worthless cruds. Better to let Conde play nowhere and get paid nothing.

[UNITED]

Dear Fire fans,

Conde is gone. He would not have started issuing statements unless he were DESPERATE to go. If you try to keep him, he will sulk, not apply himself in training, and become a joke on the field. Trade him for whatever you can now and swallow your losses.

[kpugs]

Jeffrey, how is that rabid case of blind ignorance working out for you? Well?

Conde didn't impress me last season. If the Red Bulls have to unload Dema because of salary cap issues so be it. But they'd better get more than just Conde in return.

[Dannyc58]

kpugs,

I like Dema too, but at his salary you can't expect Conde & something more in return man...

[Jeffrey]

Kpugs. Your stupid coach loves the guy. He brought him to MLS and now he wants to steal him away. I guess your Osorio is the one with blind ignorance. And let me guess, you have seen Conde like twice on television or something so you are the expert on the Chicago Fire defense since you have spent so long studying it. The Fire just unloaded Curtain because they were sown up in the back. If Conde wanted to leave he should have said so way before now.

[Carter Daly]

I think we should be able to pull this off if Conde is truly set on joining NY. In situations like this it is almost always the player/coach that gets what they want. Just look at how Osorio was hired. I think Deam would be one of the central pieces to the deal, perhaps one of our current CBs, probably a draftpick.

[Dominghosa]

Have you guys forgotten?
Professional soccer is a world where tampering doesn't exist.
I expect Conde to be in NYRB's starting lineup by April.

[Jonny]

STammler is garbage? What? Stammler would step in and start for Chicago TOMORROW. So would Jeff Parke and/or Carlos Mendes. So would Dema Kovalenko. So take two of those guys and a first-round pick and be done with it.

Chicago fans are freakin stupid. I get the anger for Conde wanting to leave, but the irrational talk about wanting the world for him is retarded.

And anybody who says Chicago shouldn't trade him and should just let him hold out is retarded. You would rather let him not play than get some players who could actually help you? Right. That makes loads of season.

Grow up Fire fans. Just deal with the fact that most people would rather be in New York.

[dwbpnm]

Jonny, of course trading Conde for something would make the Fire better than having him holding out, but the problem in your logic is that it while the soccer they would be capable of playing would improve the level of their play relative to their competition (NY) would be worse than with Conde sitting at home. The Fire shouldn't send Conde to NY without at least Dane Richards and significant draft picks, allocations, and/or other players coming back in return. Either that or make Conde buy out his contract for the equivalent of significant allocation money(like EJ did) although I'm not sure Conde has enough money to do this.

[wendel]

to all the fire fans complaining about dema's salery dont forget that he has to renegotiate his contract so i doubt he'll be making what he made last year no matter what team hes on. hes still a very productive player who didnt get enough playing time because of some unfortunate injuries and a car accident.

[dwbpnm]

Don't forget the market has just been set by DC getting Kirk in return for Vanney(who Conde is much better than) and he wasn't even under contract.

[B.A.]

*points to Galaxy*

psst, Chicago and RBNY! Make a three-way trade with the Galaxy, and you'll both come out winners.

Excepting that, about how much allocation money does RBNY have available?

[EDB]

I send him out on loan to another club or sell him during the transfer window. I would tell him its the only way hes leaving. People are forgetting the presidence it will set if you trade someone because they make a big stink then everyone who comes to the fire and doesnt like someone will say they want to be traded. You are a paid professional, be professional

[Joamiq]

Chicago doesn't HAVE to trade him, but if you think they would rather just let him sit rather than make a trade with the Red Bulls, you're naive. As angry as you Fire fans might be about it, that doesn't exactly help the team. I know it sucks, but what are you going to do? He doesn't want to play for your team.

[Joamiq]

dwbpnm - the Vanney trade doesn't apply here, since he wasn't the one forcing the deal.

[Josh]

As a fan of neither team, I think both sides fans are delusional in their scenarios. I see allocation money, picks and maybe a player being sent to NY. But this idea that you can package together a bunch of avg players the team doesnt want to get him is silly. Likewise is getting Josy. Then again Chicago can tell me to shut his mouth and be a professional...I am tired of players not wanting to fulfill these contracts they signed within a year

[JB]

Freeman would probably help Chicago. Freeman and some allocation money sounds reasonable.

[Lalique]

Anybody that thinks Chicago shouldn't trade him is both naive and not very business-savy. Yes, Conde has a contract with MLS to play in Chicago, but it's safe to assume that Conde NEVER would have signed with MLS had Osario not brought him in. Does this mean, he HAS to be traded - no, but if he isn't, then the likely results will be:

He becomes a cancer on the field, in the locker room, and he affects general morale. I doubt he'd throw a game, but he may not put as much effort into his play. Chicago loses for carrying a player taking up CAP room and an SI slot.

He could be benched until his contract is up (a year?). OK, so he gets paid for a year and then can sign with another team being that he's out of contract - enter RBNY and Chicago gets nothing.

The alternative is that Chicago can trade him. They can trade him directly to RBNY or they can trade him to another team (and then RBNY will make a trade to get him anyway). Chicago won't get fleeced in this trade, but they definitely won't get dollar for dollar in value - that's business since they have an unhappy player that's losing value every day he stays in chicago (any employee in any profession that is unhappy at work will not perform to their peak ability on a daily basis). THe difference being that most people don't have a contract that will pay them regardless of whether they perform on game day or not.

If Hamlett & Co. were smart, they'd start looking to pick up Stammler, Parke, or Mendes as part of the trade so that they have a capable defender that can at least step in and play in the back. What they get as the rest of the trade is anybody's guess, but it won't be Angel, Altidore, or Richards under any circumstances.

[dwbpnm]

I'd say the Vanney trade certainly applies, since he was unwilling to play for DC at the salary they were willing to pay him so he had to go elsewhere. The only way this materially differs from the Conde situation is that DC may have had a bidding war for Vanney. Nonetheless the trade sets an expected value for the rights to a player of Vanney's caliber. We can all agree that Conde is of a higher caliber so the Fire would rightly expect more in return for Conde than DC got for Vanney. Richards is probably better than Kirk by an equivalent amount to the difference between Vanney and Conde. Therefore player wise Conde for Richards would be equivalent to Vanney for Kirk. Unfortunately for NY Kirk is GA so he only counts as a developmental player and Richards I believe is a senior player. As a result Chicago will also rightfully expect to receive additional compensation (allocations or draft picks) to account for the salary differences between Kirk and Richards.

[Jeffrey]

Here is Guppy's response to Conde's comments: "We are aware of Wilman's interest to play in New York, however Wilman is under contract with the Chicago Fire and we do expect him to perform all of his obligations in a professional manner. As always, the interests of the Chicago Fire are paramount in all player decisions."

(from Luis Arroyave)

[dwbpnm]

NY can not just sign him when he's out of contract as we've seen with Gomez and Vanney going to Colorado and LA. I believe when a player leaves a team(and was not cut by the team) the team retains his rights for two years. Therefore NY couldn't sign Conde as a free agent for 3 years(assuming you're right about his contract only having 1 more year on it).

[Carter]

haha good luck with that Guppy.

[Lalique]

dwbpnm - correct, currently once his contract is up Chicago will still retain his rights within the league, but isn't the collective bargaining agreement close to being up? Free agency will find it's way into it this time around. And if it doesn't, RBNY still won't be able to sign him (they haven't lost anything in this scenario), but Chicago will lose him on a free transfer to another league for absolutely nothing. Just ask NE how they felt about getting nothing for Noonan and Doorman when their contracts were up.

[Felix]

First Osorio, and now this. I'm a Fire fan, and even though I was disappointed about Osorio going, he made some decisions in retrospect that were questionable, and to tell the truth, I don't think we were going any further with him.
But Conde leaving is another matter. In the short time he was here I think he was by far one of the best defenders in MLS last year. I was worried about this when Osorio left and now it's going to come to fruition.
I understand some of the sentiment from fellow Fire fans about letting him rot. But that's just childish and stupid. If your forced in losing a player of Conde's quality, you have to get something for him. Not letting him play, and "rot" on his couch until his contract expires is stupid. Get something for him if your going to lose him. Angel and Altidore are untouchable I'm sure by NYRB, so forget that, but I would INSIST on Dane Richards and probably Dema Kovalenko as well. If I remember right about the Red Bulls, they didn't have the greatest centerbacks, so I'm sure Osorio will see the need to have a player of Conde's skill and versatility and will be willing to pay a price for him aka Dane Richards.
Will see how this plays out.

[dwbpnm]

Lalinque, I believe the CBA has 2 more seasons left so if(and its a big if) free agency becomes a reality NY could sign him in 2 years instead of 3. I'd agree that Chicago should get something for him instead of letting him sit on the bench for a year and then leave MLS for free like Noonan and Dorman. But thats different than sending him to NY for crap in return.

[Smith]

Hey, Chicago Fans...How about Leitch, Magee, some GOOD Pizza & a life size photo of Bob Bradley (circa 2004 - BOX MIDFIELD ERA) for Conde?

I know a lot of RBNY/Metro Fans hate DC or LA or all things New England, but me??? There's something about seeing Guppy run your team into the ground which is just too wonderful for words.

(Can't wait till Nick starts running Philly.
That might be even better!)

Maybe we can send the rights to Charlie Stillitano to Chicago to help Guppy out as part of the Conde Deal. Yeah, the rights to Matt Knowles too.

I love you folks in Chicago. You make me laugh so hard when you are outraged.

[Connor]

Give up anyone except Jozy, Angel, or Dane. Any of the others are expendable. Conde is easily one of the best defenders in this league and he was INCREDIBLE for Chicago last year and I honestly believe that he( not Blanco) was the reason their whole season turned around. The guy is a beast and is young and could lead this defense for years to come.

[AZ Fire]

Smith:

I'm trying to remember. When's the last time your team won...anything? You may believe that our team is being run into the ground, but - even if that's true - at least we had a high point to come down from. NY can steal our coach and our best defender and your team will still be a steaming pile of fetid garbage.

[Modibo]

And they put the RBNY at Chicago game when in the schedule this year? In like November? There's going to be a din in Bridgeview when Osorio and crew come, Conde or no Conde.

[Warren]

NOw after being mad about this the whole day I can only think of one solution to this.

No, the Red Bulls are obviously NOT going to give JPA or JOzy up, but you know what? No Conde.

This dude is arguably our best defender and one of the best defenders in the league. SO if the Red Bulls say they wont give up JOzy or JPA (more specifically JOzy) their telling us, ok. We want your best defender, one of the best in the league, for a load of crap that were willing to unload on you (no offense to the players you mentioned). HOwever it would be completely ridiculous for the Fire to even listen to the Red Bulls if they want COnde and want to give anything less then Jozys caliber in return.

[eshad15]

The only way that it makes sense for the fire to unload conde is if they get Richards in return. They need a right sided midfielder/forward and at least have some cover at the back, but to get anybody else other than angel or altidore which isnt going to happen, is worthless and the Fire would be better served by sitting conde at home because then at least they wouldnt have to compete against him in the East

[Amit]

I'm a NY fan, but I feel that Conde is not being a good professional here. A trade for Kovalenko, Parke/Mendes, and allocation money would be wonderful for Chicago, however. Aside from the other guys, Chicago could use the allocation to get a Conde replacement.

[Haig]

"We want your best defender, one of the best in the league, for a load of crap that were willing to unload on you"

What you don't seem to understand (but believe me the folks who run the Fire do) is that NY isn't asking for a THING.

This is Conde's doing. He gave the Fire notice that he wanted to move, and they didn't act on it. Now he has taken it public, and NY still isn't "asking" for him.

That's why any sense that Chicago might have NY over a barrel is wishful thinking on the part of twice-spurned Fire fans. Sorry, boys, it's a lose-lose for you.

[guillermo]

As a fire fan, I have no desire to see the load of mediocrity that has been suggested above in a Fire jersey. If this immature a--clown wants to play for the carpet bagger then I suggest we let him...once his contract expires. If he does not want to play he can sit home. The deal from NY has to be much better than any combination of Dema/Stammler/Parke/Mendes, etc.

[papa bear]

@Posted by: Jonny | February 16, 2008 at 04:45 PM
you've obviously seen Conde play 1 maybe 2 times if you seriously think Stammler is good value.

@Posted by: Connor | February 16, 2008 at 06:23 PM
You basically listed all the reasons why one of your list in 'untouchables' would have to be in play or 'no dice' Conde is the best defender in the league.

@Ives: that list of possible trade bait is not only insulting but ridiculous, but expected from a true RBNY homer.

@everyone suggesting him holding out is bad etc.:
You do realize that if you start holding out into the season without an injury that the club doesn't have to pay him, right? How long do you think he's going to sit and rot for free? Not long.

He can take a hike. I'll take Richards + allocation money + a 1st rounder in return. That is fair value for the best defender in the league.

[papa bear]

@Posted by: Haig | February 16, 2008 at 06:50 PM

you REALLY believe that RBNY doesn't want him and Osorio hasn't been getting in his ear to raise this fuss? You are more gullible than you let on.

[furia yanqui]

To the guy who said this is the way it is in MLS, not Europe ... imagine if Michael Bradley had said, "Screw Heerenveen. I want out in this transfer window. I want to play for Everton." You would be calling him an idiot, and you would be right. Instead, Bradley said he would play out his contract and not sign an extension. So it's up to the club if they want to sell him while they can.

And to those who think Conde is great for being honest and "following his heart" ... Be a man. Show that you are a player that can stand on his own skill, wherever and for whatever coach.

I don't believe that Conde told the Fire that he wants out. They would have never got rid of Curtin if they thought they wouldn't have Conde. And they have made public statements from the beginning that he is going nowhere.

JCO is pulling the strings on this one ...

[Curtis Spiteri]

Thornton? Are you kidding me? Thornton?

Please. I'm better than him. Keep him, but watch to make sure he doesn't eat all the doughnuts in your morning meetings.

I think Richards, Dema, Stammler and a first round draft pick ought to do it.

Good luck Team Juan Valdez.

[Haig]

Papa Bear, after your tantrums during the Osorio saga, and your completely erroneous predictions about compensation, color me gobsmacked that you would return for round two.

[kevin]

if he won't perform for the Fire, we should just trade him to someone other than NYRB. This sucks, Conde is a really good player

[Amit]

The way the off- season has gone so far, D.C. might get Conde for Jaime Moreno with the prospect of having Jaime retire upon arrival in Chicago! Sorry, but D.C. pulls the trigger on some MLS head- scratchers.

[Jonny]

Papa Bear is so full of $hit it's not even funny. Papa, you're one of these clowns who sits and home and pretends to have a clue about what really goes on. You don't know shizzle.

Stammler for Conde straight up doesn't make sense but Stammler is a good talent who is worth Chicago getting. That said, a package of Dema-Parke-Magee and a draft pick is more than fair for a player who DOESN'T want to play for you guys.

[Jonny]

Yanqui, Michael Bradley didn't ask to be transferred because he'll get a better offer this summer. BUT, if he had said "I want to go to Everton" he would be at Everton right now. That's how the rest of the world works.

[Mark]

The Chicago fans saying that the Dema, Parke, Stammler, Mendes group is garbage have no idea what they're talking about. None of the guys in that list is an all-star talent, but these guys could start on most MLS teams. I've seen Conde play a couple of times, but he didn't stand out when I saw him play, so I have no clue if he was good or not, and don't claim to know. If Ives says he's pretty good, then that's good enough for me.

Rather than rush into anything, I think RBNY should let this simmer for a while and see how this plays out.

[Smith]

Okay, AZ Fire. You're right. We'll give you Leitch, Magee, the Picture of Bradley AND an 8 x 10 of Nowak celebrating your ONE MLS Title (as if you're Houston or DC & can actually brag about anything. Please. All you have going for you is good Polish food.)

Yes, we've been lousy all these years, no denying, but now that you're stuck with Guppy, you will find yourself in the corner of your mother's basement crying into your Lubos Kubik replica jersey wishing it were 1999. Have a good time.

[Osorio Hamlett]

These comments have at least proven one thing conclusively, it's almost impossible for RBNY or CF fans to be objective!

I am sure RBNY would just love to unload a bunch of mediocrity on Chicago for Conde, but how could anyone think that Chicago would do such a thing. If they do, they need a new coach as well. If I am the coach of Chicago, I already have a good defense and I don't need backup players (most likely) for a good player. I certainly don't need Thornton, as I am sure no one else does either.

I don't think RBNY should give up Richards. Conde is a good player but Richards is going to be a really good player and his role with RBNY is more important for them than Conde would be to them. They need Richards to feed Altidore and Angel. How about Reyna? Here's your opportunity RBNY fans! Just kidding! I don't see that RBNY has anything to offer that they don't need and is of value to Chicago. I can't believe RBNY hasn't signed more players. They could really use Conde or anyone of quality.

It seems like the only way this could happen is a first round draft pick, allocation money, and maybe a player of at least some use to Chicago. Sorry, RBNY fans but nobody wants your mediocre defenders or washed up goalkeeper. On the flip side papabear said: "I'll take Richards + allocation money + a 1st rounder in return. That is fair value for the best defender in the league." That's really funny Papabear. Show the RBNY fans that you can be just as delusional as they are!

[Eugene]

I'm alright for getting Conde to NY, but I think NY could do just as well without him. Trade Altidore for Conde? No way, as another poster said, the allocation money from Jozy's transfer will fund the team well in 09, possibly for years, and you also have to consider Altidore's contribution in 08.

Dane Richards for Conde? Not a good deal. Its harder to find a quality right wing in this league than a servicable left back.

Next year's first round draft pick? Why deal that now before the season has started? I don't think NY should deal it period because there are always interesting Generation Adidas players available in the first round. But even if a team were to deal the pick, it would be unwise in preseason -- who knows, Conde could have a season shortening or ending injury a month from now and we'd still be out a pick in 09. That wouldn't be worth it.

On the other hand, if Conde is unhappy he's unlikely to put 100% into practices or games. It may be worthwhile for Chicago to trade him to at least get SOME quality. I really think there are lots of Conde-like players in Latin America, to shake up NY to get him isn't worthwhile.

[AZ Fire]

Smith:

Let's see...

In addition to the 1 MLS Cup, the Fire boasts 2 other MLS Cup Finals appearances, and US Open Cup titles in '98, '00, '03 (over NY), and '06. In addition, they earned their way to the Supporter's Shield in '03. Perhaps I'll wear my replica Kubik jersey, but I may want to change it out for other names like Stoitchkov, Wolff, Beasley, Nowak, or Wynalda. Like I said, at least we managed to have a high point in our team's history.

[DC Fan]

"If Conde wants to leave, the Fire doesn't really have much leverage."

----------------

Tell that to DC United's front office.

It's fun seeing this whole thing from afar Bwhahahahaha VAMOS UNITED may your two clubs rot in hell.

[Mike]

What are the MLS rules in regards to tampering? NYRB does not look to be playing by the rules. Anyone who thinks Osorio isn't behind this is crazy. I'm thinking the league should look into this.

Wilman Conde is under contract and the best defender on the club. How could anyone, even New Jersey fans, expect the Fire to part with anything less than a quality player or DP slot in return?

[Drew]

Why do people always tell others on blogs like this to "grow up"? Anyone else get tired of reading the same insult used over and over?

If the Fire can't get what they deem sufficient compensation for Conde, then why not let him sit & rot? The team has to show that it will not be held hostage by whatever whim a player/coach has. They have to already be furious by what JCO/Red Bulls did; why would they trade them their best defensive player to them after the sh** they pulled? Since they don't have to trade him to NY, then should expect an extremely healthy return to make it worth it.

Also, this situation has nothing to do wanting to live in NY...JCO's was b/c his wife snapped the whip, but Conde's isn't. So get off your NYC-center-of-the-universe high horse BS. It's old & played.

Anyone who isn't impressed w/Conde "needs to grow up" ;) because he's a top shelf MLS defender. Period.

[Furniture Music]

Hey DC Scum blow it out your a$$!

[Another DC Fan]

Send him to New England and let him talk with the Krafts about a transfer

[Eugene]

In other news, apparently RSL has told Chris Lancos he doesn't factor into their plans in '08. Lancos played the season before last in Kaiserslautern, also played at Maryland and is a product of Bradenton. The kid is 23, and I believe is a left-sided player.

NY should call him into training and get a look at him. This is exactly the kind of player that could provide depth for the team on the left side, likely as a left back. He may even have upside considering his resume.

Here is the news:

http://deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,695253541,00.html

[xjas]

MLS should look in If Osorio has anything to do w/ it kick him out of the league
And foe Conde He needs to be more professional. Chicago should not trde him for nothing. If the league do not stop this
sh.... this will get out of hand

[ryan]

what about a three way trade? how about mastroeni to chicago, money, combo players, draft pick to colorado, and conde to new york for starters. mastroeni replaces armas or could go to the very back. mastroeni is still a great defense marshall. colorado had a good defense last year statistically though their offense sucked which made all their games boring. it still good for chicago money for a new forward maybe get kovalenko for defensive cover for gomez which is what mastroeni would have been doing draft picks etc. new york gets their central defender. i am sure there are other possibilities. any thoughts

[Smith]

Yes, AZ. You had a high point. No you have Guppy. Let me quote Johnny Thunders, "You can't put your arms around a memory." Have fun crying in mom's basement, eating kilbasa.

[Dannyc58]

So get off your NYC-center-of-the-universe high horse BS. It's old & played.

Posted by: Drew
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Drew, who said that?

[Drew]

Dannyc58:

Grow up Fire fans. Just deal with the fact that most people would rather be in New York.

Posted by: Jonny | February 16, 2008 at 04:45 PM

[Matt]

Welcome to MLS, Chicago can cut him and they'll still hold his rights. Kovalenko, Park, Mendes? Get real. Surely the Fire isn't going to get Jozy or a DP, but they'll get what they want or Conde will be out of MLS for the next two years.

[Mike ruze]

ANYTHING LESS THAN RICHARDs FORGET ABOUT IT. Even a straight up deal Richards for Conde is one sided as Richards isnt nearly as good as Conde. Conde Could be MLS defender of the year.

Kovalenko and Stammler are not worth Conde. THeres no way we should be trying to make Red Bulls better or give them Conde for free after they fleeced the Fire for Osorio.

Screw Conde he could rot on the bench or send him to Europe for a free transfer.

Anything but letting your conference rivals get your best defender for crap players.

[eric]

its funny how fire fans say, "our player!" correct me if I'm wrong, this is osorios player. if it wasn't for him he wouldve never been with the fire. let him go with his daddy osorio.

[cbr]

altidore is going to shatter the transfer record for an american....so erase the jozy for conde idea.

You guys have have Goldthwait and the rights to Miles Josheph

[furia yanqui]

Michael Bradley didn't say anything because, unlike Conde, he has respect for his teammates, the club that gave him his chance and himself. You give your all to a club until you actually are with another club. That's what men do, that what little Bradley is doing. If you don't, how is the next club to know that you won't do the same to them?

RBNY is so desperate they don't care that JCO and Conde are little hoors.

FTP -- f#@$# these p(*W!@utos.

[Dannyc58]

Drew,

Didn't see that. As a NYRB fan, let me just say I think that is one of the more idiotic points made on this post.

Sorry about that.

[Redrising]

The Fire had to pay what was rumored a $300,000 transfer fee to Millionares for his rights (which was low because JCO knew the club had financial issues and needed the cash), they also gave Millionares a percentage of future transfer fees (which will play huge because you will see Conde playing in Europe in a year or two- he's that good).

I have met Conde several times, and he is even bigger in person; the dude is a beast: big, fast, left footed with quick skillful feet. I saw every game he played last year (and all home games in person), this guy will make Best Eleven this year- again, he is that good.

What people forget is that Osario is all about defense and has stated that he needs a big left-footed defender in his scheme. Since I don't believe that he has found that player yet in NY, I think that he would give up Dane Richards for an equally-talented top young defender with Euro transfer fee written all over him.

But even with that, I think that the Fire owner, (who ultimately calls the shots) might balk at any deal to NYRB just because of JCO's involvement and possible tampering. Don't think money or compensation will be as important as the principle of the whole thing.

Wait until JCO pulls the same stuff on NYRB's when he gets a Euro coaching opportunity- it will happen as JCO is a true Machavellian disciple.

[irishapple21]

If Conde wants to go to New York, Chicago is in a tough spot. If they keep him, he will refuse to play and they will basically forfeit the cap space. If they trade him to RBNY, they will get very little in return -- because Osorio knows Conde wants out badly and he can negotiate difficult terms. I don't envy Chicago's situation. First, Guppy screws up Toyota Park and now he can't control turnovers in coaching staff or roster. Fire fans have to be very upset right now.

[MIKE RUZE]

Solution:

Sell Conde to Club America. The only city thats dirtier and more unsafe than NY. Good thing the Metro stars I meand Red Bulls (what are you calling yourselves these days?) dont play in NY.

Under no circumstance should the NEW JERSEY metro bulls end up with Conde without Richards.

[aristotle]

DING! DING! DING! ..... and the fight is over folks. What an ugly fight it was, too. Both sides just hopelessly flailing at each other with nobody really landing any significant or meaningful blows.

I'm telling ya, watching this fight was sad. Real sad. How sad? It was sad like a period in my life that I don't like to talk about much, a time when I used sit alone in my mom's basement eating Kilbasa. Good night folks!

[Joamiq]

I tend to stay out of the insult barrage on this blog, aside from the occasional late night anti-DC rant, but...

You Fire fans make me LAUGH. I sympathize with you, because this is an unfair situation, but your overblown estimations of your team and your underestimations of everyone else are just hilarious. You're doing your team no favors as far as the intelligence of its supporters is concerned.

DC Fan: You're a flaming idiot, don't ever speak again. DC's players were not under contract, so they owed them nothing and were taking no cap hit, hence they could do whatever they wanted. Not so with Conde.

furia yanqui: Conde came to MLS for Osorio, not for your pathetic club. Get over yourself.

papa bear: The best defender in the league! Too funny.

[Joamiq]

And now for something completely different: "In addition, the News of the World reported Sunday that the United States may replace Scotland as an opponent for England in an exhibition game at Wembley on May 28."

That would be, um, a downer.

[Bobbie B.]

Another knock against league owned contracts. It's actually more advantageous for clubs to sell players to other leagues than it is to barter at a disadvantage with other teams in MLS. This whole thing would be way less annoying to a Fire fan like me if the MetroBulls would just send us a pile of cash instead of having to swallow a package of training camp cuts and draft picks.

[rit]

Typical South American behavior when they want out...Do you really think Osorio's wife makes the decisions of her husband's career? Please, wake up, it's a front South Americans use to get out of their contractual obligations.

I hope the fire let him rot on the bench if he acts up, someone has to nip this behavior in the bud.

[Bravo]

"We want your best defender and one of the best players on your team.... but we wont give up any of our 3 best players. But you can have a keeper you got rid of and will be no better than any keeper you have now."

I know RBNY isn't going to give up Altidore or Angel, but why should the Fire agree to some deal that is in huge advantage to RBNY because the player wants to be with his buddy?

[Tim F.]

WAY TO GO CONDE. WE WANT YOU AS WELL. KEEP IT UP!!!

The Fire should make this trade; the Red Bulls might be willing to part with any combination of Dema Kovalenko, Kevin Goldthwaite, Carlos Mendes and Zach Thornton.

[Tom in Newark]

I'd like to think that the Fire front office and Fire fans are as stupid as wanting Altidore for Conde. Setting aside arguments about who's a better player and the fact that trading a forward for a defender is almost never done one for one (there's a reason why forwards generally get payed better, it's called scoring goals). Altidore if he continues his career arc, he will play very few games at all this season for his club team. He's got the Nats, Olympic qualifying and a potential mid-summer transfer to a foreign club. If he plays a half dozen games and scores a half dozen goals, then all that does is seal a transfer. The last thing you want is a player who will be gone before the end of the season. But hey, don't let me stop you. Go ahead. It's like paying face value on a 20-year note just before it expires.

Come to think of it, you have a deal.

[Onionsack]

Tom,

NY stands to make 2/3 of the transfer fee and a 500K allocation upon Jozy's sale.

So Conde for essentially 6 Million in funds and a $500K allocation (even if Jozy never suited up) is a great deal whenever you tender that note for Chicago.

Thats why RB fans are saying its ridiculous, we don't even have to get to a player v player analysis.

[11226]

Where will Conde go when Osorio is fired halfway through the season because his RB team sucks, as usual?

I honestly can't understand why anyone would rather be on another crappy RB team than on what could be a great Chicago team this year. I say this as a season ticket holder.

[Drew]

Thanks Dannyc58. I thought so too.

I think the main point of this whole situation is what a shame it is that Conde is making a mess of the Fire b/c he wants to go play for his coach...the same coach who brought him to the Fire and then abandoned him. If anything, Conde should be f'n pissed off that Osorio brought him to Chicago and then left him in his dust. Maybe Osorio isn't that great of a coach (horrible substitutions/line-up @ Revs) & friend (abandonment of fire franchise, team, city, fans AND the player he brought from Colombia) after all, have you thought of that Conde? Anyway, he'll probably end up chasing him to Europe or somewhere else after the season, and NY will experience the same sense of frustration and anger that we are all feeling.

In the meantime, the good news is that we are about to get another huge rival in NY. Gonna feel a bit like the old Knicks - Bulls rivalries. And like many Bears fans say that if the team wins 2 @ the packers and lose all other games, it's still a successful season of sorts. Personally, I wouldn't want to give up the playoffs, but there will be no other games that I'll want to see the Fire win more than the ones vs. NY. Go friggin Fire!

[furia yanqui]

Time for another cage match?! Damn, we might have seen some real ugliness between supporters if a) any NYRB fans ever travelled and if b) there were many NYRB fans to begin with, home as well as away.

This, like the JCO thing, is not an insult to the Fire as a club or Chicago as a city. It also is not a testament to RBNY as a club or even NY as a city (great as it is). Make no mistake -- it is all about the benjamin$$$$ with these two cafetero$$$$.

I still stand by my post JCO prostituting himself prediction that the Fire will finish ahead of RBNY in the standings and will go further toward the MLS Cup.

[Paul Camarda]

Why would should Red Bull give up anything good for Conde? As far as i'm concerned their doing chicago a favor by taking a player who no longer wishes to be with their team, off their hands. It would be completely retarded to think that Red Bull should have to give up a player of true value like Juan Pablo Angel, Jozy Alitore or even Dane Richards. I Think red bull should unload one of their mediocore players like Dema Kovalenko, jeff parke, carlos mendes, mike magee, or john wolyneic along with a 1st round draft pick. I think this should be more than enough. After all its not our fault that chicago's star defener no longer wants to play for their sorry club any more. This is chicago's problem not ours.(next time don't sign players who don't have a strong desire to be a part of your club.)

[Eugene]

Paul,

I don't know if you're a NY fan, but as a NY fan, I don't consider Kovalenko, Parke, Mendes or Wolyniec to be mediocre players. In fact, I don't think that many other NY fans do, let alone the NY front office. So given that, I don't see why NY would have to trade a pkg of these players plus a potentially very valuable 1st round draft pick to Chicago for a player that no longer wants to play there.

Furthermore, as a NY fan, I hope that NY retains Kovalenko, Parke, maybe Mendes and our '09 1st round pick. I've seen what these guys can do and I'm happy to have them on the team I support. Magee is a decent player but has battled constantly with injuries and Woly is surplus, so I can see these guys going somewhere else this season.

I agree with you 100% that this is Chicago's problem and NY doesn't have to bend the team over to accomodate them.

[Gigi]

This reminds me of the ante Razov scenerio with columbus and how he wanted to be with Ny and Coach Bob Bradley........and then how he wanted to be reunited with Bob at chivas...

chances are conde is leaving chicago wheather it will be to NY or some other team/possibly a return to colombia???

only time will tell....